Talk:List of necromancer skills/Archive 2

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This page is an archive. The contents have been moved from another page for reference purposes only, and should be preserved in their current form. Discussion or voting on this page is not current. Any additions you make will probably not be read.
The current version of this page can be found at Talk:List of necromancer skills.

Description

So I added the column for the descriptions; I just learned to coding tonight so it took me some time. I hope it looks good. I think so. I thought it would be easier than clicking on the skills to see what they do.

and how don't we have icons for those two skills all by their lonely selves. Just wondering. -Lord Cyrus

Hello and welcome, Cyrus. We don't have icons for those because no one has bothered to find a video with an off-hand dagger, screencap it, and cut out the skills to upload. Also, we sign with 4 tildes(~), it links to our userpages.--Corsair@Yarrr 07:47, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
Okay, If I find time, I'll start looking for them, but I must confess that I wouldn't know how to take the skill icon from the video. Also I was wondering if we should add a "Recharge" column since many of the skills have a known recharge and then a "Traits" column for traits that improve the skill. What do you guys think?Cyrus 09:20, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
If no one is going to object, we might as well add this column to the other skill lists. Though we'll need to adapt the coding into one overall formatting standard. - Infinite - talk 21:43, 2 January 2011 (UTC)
We'll have to remove the profession picture. I think we have enough skills and skill icons to not have to "flair" it up with a picture. –~=Ϛρѧякγ AHHH! (τѧιк) ←♥– 22:36, 2 January 2011 (UTC)
Agrees with above. Should probably move from the coding here to a more similar coding on GWW... IMO Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 23:07, 2 January 2011 (UTC)
I think that having the descriptions of the skills is essential, otherwise we're just looking at a bunch of pictures. This is the only thing I care about enough to debate on this particular page. I thought the color coordination would help those who are unfamiliar with the game. That can be adjusted though for a monochromatic visual appeal. Please respond with your opinions. We can compromise and work for a beautiful, visualing appealing and informative page. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lord Cyrus (talk • contribs).
We do also care about how the page looks, those colors were horrible (especially for elites). People unfamiliar with how skill bars work would be reading the skill bar page, not a list of skills. –~=Ϛρѧякγ AHHH! (τѧιк) ←♥– 04:04, 3 January 2011 (UTC)
I would actually rather not have skill descriptions for now. IMO, it's too soon; between now and release, it's more likely that those descriptions will change than that they will be kept the same. The table seen at the list of warrior skills is still my favourite. Erasculio 11:12, 3 January 2011 (UTC)
The color scheme is fine with the blue tint seeing as how the painterly style ephasizes a monochromatic (or nearly so) color scheme. The picture can stay or go, I think it looks good with the picture. As far as the descriptions go, they are neccessary; when all the descriptions are listed, any player could look at the list and decide what they want without having to open all the pages to the skills and read what they do. In essence, the page would be more complete, informative, and usefull with the descriptions than without them. Also, I highly doubt that the descriptions will change in nature-- they may get reworded, which then the coding could be updated but the skill itself will likely remain intact. The developers said that they work and rework and rework the professions before announcing them in their practically final state. Cyrus
In the end it will look exactly like the skill lists on GWW. Including every vital variable for the skills in GW2. I propose, though, to keep the skill icons small as they are now. - Infinite - talk 21:25, 3 January 2011 (UTC)
"any player could look at the list and decide what they want": there isn't much a player may want to do with those skill descriptions until the game is released; and considering that in GW1 skills have major changes in functionality even today, it's only to be expected that the same will happen with the skills for a game that has not been released yet and has not even entered beta. Having the skills being displayed so prominently now could give players the impression that those skills are at their final forms and that they could use them to plan their gameplay, which is a rather big assumption to be made so soon.
Ah, and I had forgotten: the color scheme of this table is, IMO, rather ugly. The white cells give the feeling that the table has some holes in it. I would like to implement here Aqua's scheme from his Traits navigation table. Erasculio 22:09, 3 January 2011 (UTC)

(Reset indent) About colors: at one point (or another) we will have to have a discussion about colors, this is not the time. I agree that the current coloration is horrendous, and would much rather prefer solid to that patterned white vs. prof-color. I will also provide links to here for the colors and here for those schemes in use, as a couple other people have already voiced their opinions on those colors, but this isn't really the place for that. In addition, my personal opinion would be: no profession picture, keep table w/ skill icon and skill name, remove descriptions, and have the information rows (the parts where the skills are shown) kept in one solid color. Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 23:43, 3 January 2011 (UTC)

The implication I was trying to make but apparently did not make clear enough is that any player who is eagerly awaiting the release of GW2 can look at this page and decide a direction and a tentative skill bar that they're shooting for. Before you mention it, yes, I understand that there are lots of people who like to explore in game with all the professions and all the skills. Seeing as how the game isn't released yet, the most anybody could do now is look at all the information that's being released and decide what character they'll make when they first sign into that glorious game we're all so eager for. I'm just trying to make a point that a "Skills" page is more complete and informative when it says what the skills actually do on the same page. To me, skills and skill descriptions should be kept together, they're like PBnJ, Ketchup&Mustard, and the such. The point that skills presented in this fashion may be confused for finalized skills is...I don't think anybody could come onto the wiki page and not realise that the game isn't out yet; I feel that that is fairly apparent. And yes, the skills in GW have been altered completely but there are only a few alterations at any one time and a lot of time inbetween them so that the descriptions on GWW could be changed accordingly-I don't see how much it's different other than GW2 isn't released yet. From how much the developers emphasized that they rework the professions and fine tune them before even announcing them ...well, I think that these skills are pretty set and if they do change, we could just as easily change the descriptions.Lord Cyrus 01:39, 4 January 2011 (UTC)Cyrus
We actually don't need descriptions. Once the game is released and the skills are uncovered, the lists will include descriptions, but it's possible (and much easier) to just leave them as what they are (lists of skills). Those players who wish to look through all the skills' descriptions can and will do so regardless (it's not that much tougher for them unless it takes them a long time to load pages). I like Aquadrizzt's color scheme. –~=Ϛρѧякγ AHHH! (τѧιк) ←♥– 01:52, 4 January 2011 (UTC)
We had already planned to make the skill lists semi GWW-esque once we have the game and we know that the descriptions present are the ones on the current version of the game. Right now, all skill lists are are just that, lists of skills. They tell them what skills are available, and it makes it quite clear that we don't really know how those skills operate, we just know they exist in the game. Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 00:20, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

(Reset indent) Borrowing from Aqua's design, I would like to see a (temporary) table like this:

Only not expandable, of course. Erasculio 22:09, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

I assume the colour will be standard for all skill lists, regardless of profession? - Infinite - talk 22:14, 5 January 2011 (UTC)
No, I was using these colors. Erasculio 22:17, 5 January 2011 (UTC)
I like that design. The colors manage to compliment the skill icons (never tested it myself, but it seems to work). The links are readable, and there is a small but clear difference between one weapon and another. Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 01:53, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
Some more variations here. The only ones I'm completely happy with, to be honest, are the necromancer and elementalist lists. The warrior first list feels too orange and too monocromatic, IMO, and the ranger list feels a bit too monocromatic as well. Erasculio 02:41, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
After playing a bit with the colors, I would suggest the following schemes (I'm not even going to try with the warrior list, since yellow isn't a color I can play with very well):
Thoughts? Erasculio 13:56, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
Colours are fine. Width is acting up now, though. The weapon column and the equipped in column just don't work at that width for me. It's fine in the elementalist table, though. (And I'm not fond of all the white seperations in it.) - Infinite - talk 14:10, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
Not a big fan of the ranger green...it is far too intense for my liking... Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 00:29, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
Addendum: I'm working on a new ranger scheme, as I agree that mine is too monochromatic, and I quite honestly think that yours aren't really as cohesive as they should be. The warrior should be orange IMO and not pale yellow, so I'll work on that once I get a ranger theme pumped out. Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 00:37, 7 January 2011 (UTC)
Shouldn't the "equipped in" line for two-handed weapons read "both hands" not "two-handed"? You equip a greatsword in both hands, not in two-handed. ~Ekko (talk) 02:39, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

(Reset indent) Simpler change: "Equipped as" (Equipped as Two Handed, Equipped as Main Hand, Equipped as Off Hand) Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 02:40, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

Well, I'm fond of strong colors, so I'm a bit biased. I have made a new ranger one with a less saturared color (compare with the one above), and two for the warrior (one with a strong color and the other with less saturation):
Thoughts? Erasculio 11:48, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
1st ranger: way. too. saturated. 1st warrior: see previous comment. 2nd warrior: not cohesive enough, though I like the header color. Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 16:52, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
The header color is almost identical to the one you used : P I was mixing the orange colors with a light yellow on purpose, as I think the completely orange scheme feels a bit monocromatic. For the ranger one, I was using as a guide the saturation of the necromancer, which is still my favourite color scheme. Erasculio 17:14, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
I love the 1st Warrior! :D The warm colors are really nice. --AmannelleUser Amannelle Me.jpg 17:59, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
Actually, to add to my previous comment, I really like the stronger colors for both the ranger and the warrior. :D They look very good, and definitely not too saturated. --AmannelleUser Amannelle Me.jpg 18:00, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
Though I like the discussion of colors, it really should not be here. It has ceased to be about the article that we're discussing on and about a wiki wide thing. Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 18:13, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
To say the truth, I want to use those for the temporary skill lists we will have until we get enough information for the real lists. I'm more interested in doing that than in picking the "official" color schemes for the professions (I think we won't be able to do that until we know all professions, anyway). The color schemes I'm suggesting above are just for the lists, not for everything else (and hey, if people like them and later decide to expand for more stuff, great, but that's not the point I'm trying to make here). Erasculio 18:16, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

(Reset indent) So...should we implement necromancer and elementalist? We seem to be in agreement about those. Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 20:56, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

Go for it! Erasculio 21:47, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
So, my reasons for why warrior (yellow orange) and ranger (yellow green) need less saturation than necromancer (green) and elementalist (red). For web colors, yellow is significantly brighter, so following the saturation that is used on the red (an inherently dark color) or dark green schemes wouldn't work. I'm trying to find something a little less monochromatic, will post when I finish. Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 22:57, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
And assuming the second heavy armour class is Paragon (Red-Orange) or Monk(/paladin) (Blue/White)? (Remember the term "monk" can mean more than sir-heals-alot), what would we do about them? --Neil • User Neil2250 sig icon5 Anti.png 23:02, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
"And what do you do with speculators?" "Burn them!" "Why do speculators burn?"...anyway, the current discussion is about the currently released professions and their color schemes for this (and possibly the entire wiki TBA). It really has to be a case by case basis though :S Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 23:05, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
(Edit conflict) The last soldier is probably blue, the last scholar probably purple; what worries me the most are the two adventurers professions to be revealed. No idea why, but I have the feeling the unknown one will have an orange theme (plz don't burn me D :). Regardless, IMO that's one of the reasons why we can't decide on a color scheme for the professions yet - we need to see all "official" colors first, and then see what we can do. These schemes are only temporary. Erasculio 23:07, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

(Reset indent) Based on Venom's color, I really liked this one for rangers:

Erasculio 17:11, 15 January 2011 (UTC)

I fear it may be a bit too similar to the necro colors we plan on implementing, but I'm not sure. I like the way it looks though. Aquadrizzt (talk)(contribs) 04:42, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

This page is an archive. The contents have been moved from another page for reference purposes only, and should be preserved in their current form. Discussion or voting on this page is not current. Any additions you make will probably not be read.
The current version of this page can be found at Talk:List of necromancer skills.

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