Guild Wars 2 Wiki talk:Admin noticeboard/Archive 2017

Re: Recalibrating the Waypoints

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Since, as you point out, the Mesmer has the lowest DPS, then any other profession could reasonably use the same method to succeed.

There is little enough information for the less experienced player. Your intent to play through later today is meaningless, unless you use a character with the sort of stats that a relatively new player would use, coupled with limited experience, limited buffing resources and so on. Spacial (talk) 13:15, 3 January 2017‎ (UTC)

You seem to be arguing different points than why the guide you wrote was removed. The removed content was specifically removed due to lack of new information and too much personal opinion, I made this abundantly clear on your talk page. There were some good points in there, which consequently got added to the article. If there are certain passages of the mission you feel need more in depth explanation, you can point them out or try expanding them yourself, but re-writing the same content in different words is not the way to do so. -Darqam 13:52, 3 January 2017 (UTC)

I tried to add information of use to the less experienced players. I followed the formats of some other pages. What you have left is obscure and meaningless. Academic now. You clearly don't want any new contributors. Spacial (talk) 15:30, 3 January 2017‎ (UTC)

@Spacial, You'd be amazed how badly I can gear my characters. -Chieftain Alex 18:53, 3 January 2017 (UTC)

Okay, my mesmer has full exotics. I unequipped my elite specialization to make it fair. Started at 19:32.

• Use the calibration device to destroy the three mini waypoints. You are kicked off the device.
• Kill the wolf and the thrasher
• The Mordrem Leyleecher appears. Use the calibration device to nuke more waypoints until you get thrown off the device again. The invulnerability buff disappears and you can begin with your DPS (in my case it was the phantasmal duelist x2 + phantasmal berserker sitting in a time warp). It hides after I manage to DPS it down from 100% to 38% (even on a core mesmer).
• Tendrils popup, head directly for the one with the green star over it. Kill it to make the Mordrem Leyleecher reappear.
• Instruct Taimi to control the calibration device this time. You should now be free to DPS the Leyleecher. Mission completed at 19:38 (i.e. the combat portion of the mission took 6 minutes on the first attempt).

True I nearly got killed by the PBAoE fields in the final screenshot, but you could easily only use ranged damage. Exotic equipment isn't a greedy requirement, and it is supposed to be level 80 content. I don't think the walkthrough is missing anything major for a mildly capable solo player. -Chieftain Alex 19:56, 3 January 2017 (UTC)

Essentially a long winded version of my own description, with added jargon. Is there an entry for hypocrisy?

We are all a bunch of sad males, playing mostly female characters, in a fantasy, online game, against mythical opponents, because we are bored with TV and lack the self confidence to ask a real woman into bed.

Worrying about how the Wiki look, which will probably never be seen again, in a couple of years time, undoubtedly explains that

But hey, I'll be leaving you all to it. The hostility I've experienced over this issue has been interesting, but like the rest of you, I can get all the hassle I can handle in the real world. Spacial (talk) 00:29, 4 January 2017‎ (UTC)

First, that wasn't vandalism, it's a disagreement on content(hence why Felix moved it here), and in regards to your last comment, the wiki always wants new contributors, check out User:Dashface/On Wiki of Gold. In regards to playing through it as new player, I *did* play through that episode as a new player(had played for maybe 2 months, was still pretty darn clueless, wanted Mawdry), did it solo and had no major issues, and the majority of what you added wouldn't have helped me as a new player: the part about Taimi running the machine might have made it go faster for example, but other parts, such as stuff about the classes wouldn't have helped at all-Revenant didn't even exist when I did it, and isn't an option for those without Heart of Thorns. As these stories were intended to be played through solo, with the only notable exception I can think of is the Migraine achievement from Hearts and Minds(and that's an achievement not the main playthrough), having a "solo" guide is bit redundant, but if you want to add tips on how to get the achievement solo, that would be greatly appreciated. - Do_odleplex 21:49, 3 January 2017 (UTC)

did it solo and had no major issues, Guess I must be lying then. How tiresome for you. Spacial (talk) 23:53, 4 January 2017 (UTC)

So, as others have already pointed out, this is clearly a content dispute, not anything that directly requires admin intervention; it’s especially not a vandalism issue.

As a content dispute, the correct place to discuss this is the article’s talk page where a discussion already started. If you feel the need to continue this, then I’d ask you to do that there instead of here.

That being said, I do not mind having hints and notes targeted at solo players within walkthrough sections. However, having a completely separate section does not really make any sense since the overall strategy should be the same nonetheless. Since parts of your solo section have already been incorporated into the general walkthrough description, you might want to review the current text and see if you could be happy with that or if you feel the need to expand upon that (without reverting to your original text).

Finally, please keep in mind that this is a story mission halfway through Living World season 2. I’d say that at this point you could expect players to have some sense of the game, so you shouldn’t need to cater for players completely new to the game. poke | talk 15:38, 7 January 2017 (UTC)

Thank you Poke. I posted a walk through for solo players, specifically, those of us who don't have the 6 years or so experience of playing that other have.

Solo

If you need to solo this, it can be done, provided you have a character with a good quality, ranged weapon. Revenant, for example, is sadly, utterly useless for this, as for so many things.

After initially taking control of the device, demonstrating to Phunt that it works, all hell breaks loose.

Initially, just fight as seems appropriate. Eventually you will be asked if you or Taimi will control the device.

Let Taimi do it.

Phase 1. Up pop the wiggly roots. Braham will find the one to destroy. Join him in that and the boss will appear, shrouded in a protective bubble.

Phase 2, Up pops a Mordrem Husk. It will head for Taimi. It must be destroyed. A second appears, same priority. A third will appear. This time it just needs to be damaged before the shroud protecting the boss (and the third husk), disappear.

Phase 3, Use your ranged weapon to destroy the Boss. This is a wearing down process, depending upon your weapon, a certain percentage of its life line will disappear with each round.

After a time, the boss will disappear Braham will announce it has disappeared and you are back to phase 1. Get to Phase 3 again and continue to destroy that life line.

In phase 3, try to attack the boss from as far away as possible. Walk backward as it will follow you. If you are down, Braham will revive you, but you loose time.

Eventually, when the Boss' life line is exhausted, it is destroyed. It too me about 5 rounds with an Illusionist and a broad sword as my ranged weapon. Spacial (talk)

For my pains I have been ambushed with a series of often personal attacks including: but it seemed like a fairly copy-paste of the initial walkthrough but with added personal opinions and commentary. If you wish to re-write the walkthrough in a more neutral tone, and using proper creature naming. -Darqam 15:04, 29 December 2016 (UTC) "This is extremely difficult solo and few will be able to unless they are fully ascended geared and have help." was removed since it was no longer agreed to be true.it was removed since it added false, or repetitive information. -Darqam 17:12, 2 January 2017 (UTC) Just don't stand in the AoE and it's a cakewalk. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 20:01, 3 January 2017 (UTC) so it's not a complete cake walk, but by no means overly difficult. -Darqam 20:19, 3 January 2017 (UTC) Lol you didn't even use timewarp. -Chieftain AlexUser Chieftain Alex sig.png 20:31, 3 January 2017 (UTC) I was doing it solo as a new player(I think I'd played for maybe 2 months and wanted Mawdry to eat bloodstone dust), and I had no problem with this episode at all. - Doodleplex 20:54, 3 January 2017 (UTC) the problem largely boils down to bringing a mesmer in PvE, which has one of the poorest DPS ; and so are expected to require decent gear (for example, level 80 exotic items with berserker stats + food). ; Chieftain Alex sig.png 07:33, 3 January 2017 (UTC) The removed content was specifically removed due to lack of new information and too much personal opinion, Darqam 13:52, 3 January 2017 (UTC)

I was happy to contribute to the wiki, but given the reception of personal attacks, accusations of plagiarism, pretentious references to neutral tones, (This is a game, lighten up people!!!),

pointless advice, (since I have self evidently completed it successfully), Implications that I am a liar, suggestions that one of the stock characters (Mesmer) is actually unsuitable for the game, along with evidence that these people can't even agree on what it is they are criticising.

Are you serious?

Do you really expect me, or anyone else to contribute?

I am more than happy to take on board criticism, and readily changed some parts. Removing the reference to Revenant, giving the correct name for 'wiggly roots', That, evidently, wasn't what these people wanted though.

I find many entries in this wiki to be inaccurate or incoherent. References to items, facilities which I don't know of, therefore others won't either. Terminology which is not explained.

We all know that many here are so very experienced and are suitably turned on whenever they walk past. But a wiki is for those who haven't done it, not those who have. Spacial (talk) 00:42, 9 January 2017‎ (UTC)

I've now read through all of the edits, across all of the pages. I've not seen a singe count of a personal attack against you, nor any accusations of plagiarism (which would require you to have copied information verbatim from a website like Dulfy's). As has been pointed out, this issue is about content and should be discussed on the proper page, Talk:Recalibrating the Waypoints. G R E E N E R 01:27, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

I've not seen a singe count of a personal attack against you, nor any accusations of plagiarism

The Nelson defence. How very quaint.

Moreover, the issue is contributions to this wiki. I have asked why anyone would contribute when they get the sort of aggressive reception I have experienced after one edit?

As it stands, this wiki is terrible. Spacial (talk) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.16.68.132 (talk • contribs) at 10:59, 9 January 2017‎ (UTC).

You shouldn't be surprised that we're not impressed with you. You submitted virtually the same submission three times to the same page, with no significant changes between revisions, with each revision being responded to in civil terms on various talk pages explaining why the edits didn't meet our expectations for guides. Your responses are unfortunate - so goodbye. -Chieftain Alex 18:47, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

Spacial, I thought I was being clear that the discussion here was ended. I certainly did not invite you to post your walkthrough again—especially not here. But that seems to be your primary issue here: You’re not listening. So all the constructive criticism other have given to you before was completely ignored and you kept on trying to post it your way. But that’s not how a wiki works. And seeing personal attacks when there are none, and generally being somewhat hostile will not help you make your point. So I’d suggest you to change your behavior. poke | talk 21:34, 9 January 2017 (UTC)

Poke, I know, but winding you people up is incredibly funny.

You take like too seriously, young man. Spacial (talk) 00:01, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

Serge Yseron

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Have we ever considered blocking that dude? He seems to just post on his talk page with youtube links like it's a blog. -Chieftain Alex 18:03, 5 June 2017 (UTC)

It's been mentioned a few times before. I agree that it's pushing the limits of what this wiki and its userspace is for. Last time it was 'discussed', Relyk stated that he "doesn't post nearly enough to be distracting", which is something I disagree with. It does honestly feel like a personal blog or an echo chamber for himself. —Ventriloquist 22:34, 5 June 2017 (UTC)

If I remember properly, this was also present on the GW1 wiki. Personally I have nothing against this as it doesn't seem to really bother anyone, it's just... strange. -Darqam 22:57, 5 June 2017 (UTC)

I'm not a favor of banning him since he really doesn't cause any harm as far as I can tell, though I am in favor of asking him to limit what he posts to being just video game or GW2 related. That would make it easier to make sure it's him posting, not a spam bot or a vandal or something which quite a few times I thought is what happened and nearly reverted the edit, and keeps things that might be questionable off of here(that cougar song convo really doesn't feel like appropriate for here). - Do_odleplex 23:40, 5 June 2017 (UTC)

Hm. Tricky... On the one hand, that fellow doesn't do much harm and is just like any other of the users who strictly keep to their own user pages, on the other, what he does doesn't really fulfil a purpose for the wiki. Sure, his posts are sometimes related to the game, but it really feels like a random blog most of the time. How does this differ from the usual spam we occasionally see? Where can and should we draw the line?

@Doodle Asking this guy to limit his posts seems a reasonable approach, but I'm having my doubts whether that will change anything. He doesn't strike me as one who would comply, judging from his comments on the matter of his purpose. talk 12:17, 6 June 2017 (UTC)

I've always believed there is a quid pro quo agreement between Anet and the community, and then the community and its users. Not everyone will have the same amount of ability or desire to give back for the gift they've been given. I understand when the former is not present; I'm saddened when the latter is overtly absent. If this wiki has such an unwritten agreement with its users in that users are to give back to the community, Serge Yseron is knowingly breaking it. Please note the stress on the "if".

Serge Yseron has no desire to treat this site as a wiki. Thirteen pages of archived blogging is not what this wiki is for. I brought this issue up with Serge back in February and this is what has been created since then. G R E E N E R 16:23, 8 June 2017 (UTC)

I gave him a warning in 2014 to stop wiki squatting. I have no idea what he does or what his "viewership" is like, but I told him to keep all his posts at least somewhat related to GW. Wouldn't oppose a ban at all. -Auron 14:01, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Well he seems to have left in April. Not much point now, unless he returns for more squatting with PoF. -Chieftain Alex 17:34, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

If he does, feel free to ping me as I may have to check our content terms for these kinds of situations (I've seen names of other pieces of entertainment being mentioned in the posts, not sure if this is breaking any of our terms for the wiki). Thanks! --Stephane Lo Presti talk 19:20, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Editing the article Game Credits

The article Game credits is protected so it can only be edited by sysops. Asking Stephane, it looks like his latest edit was a bit of a mistake, in that he reverted it too far back. Additionaly, the article could also use some formatting, like changing the title of the credits, linking to the archived credits, actually adding links to the staff members that have articles in the wiki, and so on.
The thing is, who protected it was Stephane :X
I'm very much in doubt about what to do. From his talk page it looks like he doesn't oppose undoing his edit, so I guess we could allow more people to edit the article...? Or maybe it would be better to ask him directly if he would mind unprotecting the page? Or a sysop could do it, since he said he's ok with us editing, which is why I'm writing this here? Any ideas? Erasculio 19:45, 23 November 2017 (UTC)

Unprotected. Go ahead with anything you want, just try and make your edits accurate. -Chieftain Alex 20:06, 23 November 2017 (UTC)

Thank you! :) Erasculio 20:30, 23 November 2017 (UTC)

I protected this article because it's an important one from our perspective and we would like for it NOT to be edited by wiki editors in terms of content, only for linking to articles (no change to the format of the article please). I know that this is a departure from the usual rules but we want this article to be the authoritative source of information externally and we're the only ones who have the exact knowledge of who should be on that list (and where). Could you please revert your changes Erasculio? --Stephane Lo Presti talk 18:32, 27 November 2017 (UTC)

Sure! Would you mind if I kept the links to each person's article and reverted the rest? Erasculio 09:48, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Wait, looking more in detail at your changes, did you just update the main article to be the Heart of Thorns Game Credits, per the archive? --Stephane Lo Presti talk 18:04, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Yep! I just reverted to your previous edit (this one, from January 5, 2016; I think it's the last one before the one you made with the 2017 changes), added the "Heart of Thorns" title, and a "See also" linking to the 2013 archive (plus the lots of [ ]s to link to people's articles). You can use this link to see the differences between your edit and mine; I didn't add or move anyone. Erasculio 20:01, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Ok sounds good, so you leave the article as is because it's an accurate state for it. Apologies about the confusion! As soon as we've finalized the Path of Fire Game Credits, I'll post them. Thanks! --Stephane Lo Presti talk 20:09, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

Once you have the PoF credits set, would you prefer each of the releases to have their own credits page, as per Alex's suggestion? G R E E N E R 21:36, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

For some reason I never received a notification about this discussion, sorry about that! If by release you mean core+expansions, we will let you decide what makes the most sense (I added an archive as I thought it made sense but any other classification is fine as long as we maintain a chain between them?) As far as I know, the Game Credits do not appear in game and this is why we consider this article to be the authoritative external source. Let me know if that makes sense to you and if you have questions! Thanks --Stephane Lo Presti talk 21:54, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

If this is the "authoritative external source", then I'd rather we have the wiki in lockstep with how Anet views the situation (unlike say, with how we document game updates). If Anet views game credits as something which is updated from time-to-time, not necessarily in-line with major releases, then archiving would work best. If Anet views game credits as only updated with major releases, then I'd prefer definitive pages that get locked down with each release. G R E E N E R 22:05, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

We would go with the latter, Game Credits are attached to the major releases (Core, HoT, PoF), not other ones (Living World). Thank you! --Stephane Lo Presti talk 00:02, 30 November 2017 (UTC)