Talk:Sigil/Archive 1
Main and Offhand?
So are Main hand and Offhand weapons both going to have sigils? If so will two handed weapons have two sigil slots? -- Blue Phoenix 
06:16, 3 March 2012 (UTC)
- This is a good question, hopefully they address it at some point. I know that in other games they have more slots or a large bonus in 2H weapons, for example a 7% bonus instead of a 5%. Nilgoow
Sigils and Dual Skills
So will dual skills on the Thief his bar only activate one sigil (main-hand) or both (main-hand + off-hand)? 
Karuro 16:51, 22 April 2012 (UTC)
- Sigil effects are passive bonuses and not activated. I think it is if you have a weapon with a sigil equipped and active you get that boost like it is a passive and works with anything you use, not just tied to only those weapon's skills. Active being I think the sigil effects are only active for the weapons you are currently using and not active on the weapons you can swap in combat to. I don't know if two-handed weapons will allow 2 sigils to compensate.
18:32, 22 April 2012 (UTC) - Well, it looks there are actually a lot that are activated... but again doesn't matter what skill you use as long as that weapon is equipped and active anything can activated it. 18:37, 22 April 2012 (UTC)
- To attempt to answer the original question: At present if you dual wield weapons and have the same sigil on both, you can get both to fire off. If you have MIXED sigils however, only the main hand works (at this time). Tested this with numerous sigils, on both dual pistols and dual daggers on an Engineer and a Thief. Same result every time. --TokyoShoe (Wiki-Rookie) 12:41, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
Losing Cumulative Stat Bonus Per Kill
As you can see here http://youtu.be/0aZavbIBqFQ?t=17m12s you lose all stacks if you pick up a bundle. On the other hand switching into forms doesn't affect these sigils. After using Death Shroud all stacks remained the same. I don't know how Lich Form or other elite forms work with these sigils but i think they should work the same way like Death Shroud because they're all forms and should be treated the same. --Inoshiro 21:23, 22 April 2012 (UTC)
Confirmed that sigils work in Lich Form. They are based off of your current weapon, same as Death Shroud. 14 May 2014
Does anyone know if this then applies to sigils that activate on weapon swap? Since it cancels the stacks it should get the weapon swap bonus right?~Ao Allusir 03:25, 4 July 2012 (UTC)
Main and Offhand stacks
Do things like the per kill stacks stack to say 50 instead of 25 if you have the sigil in both hands? I did notice that they stack doubly as fast, but didn't get to check the maximum stack?
No, they only stack to 25. Furthermore, if you have two different sigils that give stacks on kills, such as Bloodlust and Corruption, you will only get stacks for the first one processed, which seems to be in alphabetical order. In this case, Bloodlust will stack, while Corruption is a wasted sigil slot. Even unequipping the Bloodlust weapon will not allow Corruption to stack, until the Bloodlust stack is removed by getting downed or traveling to another zone. This is possibly a bug, and has been reported as such, since there is no indication in the description text that these effects exclude others of a similar type (stack on kill)--NiSiSuinegEht 05:58, 3 September 2012 (UTC)
- however, two of same sigil will "speed up" stack charging by providing two charges for one kill. have not yet tested a minor with a major but it might just be the strongest applying and/or the case of two different types of sigils not gaining charges separately. the sigil i tested was major sigil of luck 166.164.99.200 00:04, 17 September 2012 (UTC)
Getting rid of tiers
I think the same what was done with Runes is in order for sigils, too. That is, having only one page per Sigil and keeping different tiers of them there. Mediggo 10:34, 8 June 2012 (UTC)
- Better to just start doinging a change like that, than ask and wait for someone else to do it I say. So... beginning the merge now, merged up Agony, Paralyzation, and Perception and fixed the redirect links so far. WolfWings 11:11, 22 September 2012 (UTC)
Where do you get them?
For the purpose of PvP, you can buy them in the Heart of the Mists. But where do you find them for PvE usage? Crafted? Gnarf 21:42, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
- Some sigils can be bought with tokens. I guess there should also exists some which offer them for karma. Equipment with upgrade components also have a chance of retaining the upgrade, even if you cannot actually aim to salvage the upgrade, unlike in GW1. Mediggo 16:14, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
- The [Crafting] page table shows that any of the weapon crafting disciplines can make sigils, although I haven't ever seen a recipe for one anywhere so maybe that needs to be looked at? ~Ao Allusir 20:21, 3 July 2012 (UTC)
- tailor here, so you won't see me making sigils, but I have a couple options involving runes, the armor equivalent. They can be crafted individually, but the components are either not all in game, or just very rare drops, and armor can be crafted with them already in place. Likewise, karma vendors sell a fair chunk of gear with runes (and I assume,sigils) already installed. —Torrenal 20:42, 3 July 2012 (UTC)
Mainhand+Offhand: applies to skills of both, or each?
Say I have a sword+shield weapon set, with Intelligence on the sword, and Rage on my shield.
When I use sword #1, will it have rage's bonus? And when I use shield #2, will it have intelligence's bonus?
--The answer is yes as stated on the main sigil wiki page. "...(e.g. a character with an offhand weapon imbued with a Sigil of Rage can still gain quickness when critting with their first three skills) "
"Swap Sigils" & Engineer Weapon Kits?
Do sigils with effects on a weapon swap work when an Engineer switches from normal weapons to a weapon kit (such as the Flamethrower) and back to normal weapons? Does this still count as "swapping weapons"? --TokyoShoe (Wiki-Rookie) 12:46, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
- I can answer this question now. After much (and expensive) testing in-game, Sigils with "Effect on Weapon Swap" mechanics do NOT work in combination with Engineer Weapon Kits. So don't employ these if you expect them to work by swapping in and out of your Flamethrower or Elixir Gun.
- Would also like to note, while swap sigils do not work with engineer kits (bundle dropping), they do work with elementalist attunement swapping. Note that the sigil does still have the 10 second cooldown. This should also be changed on the notes section of the main page.--98.114.199.145 16:42, 24 October 2012 (UTC)
- The December 14, 2012 patch notes say that weapon sigils are now effective when engineer kits are active. Can this be confirmed?
Confirmed. Sigil of Rage on my pistol will activate on crits generated by flamethrower attacks.
Sigil Families and research
There are a total of 55 different families of Sigils. They DONT all have minor, major and superior.
- Minor contains 41 sigils
- Major contains 53 sigils
- Superior contains 56 sigils
According to the Trading Post
Please start creating the family pages like Sigil of Luck and redirect all the minor, major and superior to the family page.
This list isn't final, there are some families missing I believe.
KingBoo talk 07:35, 11 September 2012 (UTC)
- I'm trying to the same for the runes at the moment, so a few comments: the dungeon runes are not listed on the trading post, I'd imagine the same goes for the sigils; we might want to look at a similar style (example), imo a separate acquisition section makes for a more readable page (also level requirements in the infobox); you might want to create something like this so users have an easy to access template.Vilya 10:19, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
Level Requirement
- I feel it should be noted that the level requirement for sigil looks at the weapon itself, not the character.--98.114.199.145 08:59, 21 September 2012 (UTC)
Stacking Activation Chances
The page says: "Sigils that have a chance to trigger on critical hits stack their chance percentages multiplicatively, not additively (e.g. two major sigils of fire - 20% chance on crit each - give a 24% chance on crit, not 40%)."
This explanation is not very clear, especially if that example is correct. And I'm extremely skeptical about the example being correct. How was this determined?
Intuitively, I would expect either that two identical sigils add their activation chances (20% + 20% = 40%) OR that each sigil has an independent chance to trigger, which means the total odds of one of them triggering would be 1 - (1 - .2)^2 = 36%. And in the later case, I would expect a 4% chance for both to activate on the same critical hit for a cumulative effect (whenever that would make sense). That's all just conjecture and may be totally wrong, but I'd want pretty solid evidence before believing a theory that's not one of those two.
The only case I can think of where you'd stack two 20% effects and get 24% overall is if the second effect is contingent upon the first one--that is, if you had a 20% chance of triggering, and then if that happened you had another 20% chance of triggering again on the same attack. Which would, in my opinion, be an incredibly weird stacking mechanic. And even then, that's not really a 24% chance of activation, it's just 0.24 average activations per attack.
And the more important stacking question (which isn't addressed at all, as far as I can see) is what happens when the sigils have a cooldown period before they're allowed to activate again--do both sigils share the same cooldown, or are they on independent timers? If their activation chances are independent, it seems only fair that their timers should be as well... --192.168.104.82 08:26, 3 October 2012 (UTC)
- I'm pretty sure whoever wrote the current note got their math backward on the chance for the second sigil to activate. This is exactly the same situation as a 20/20 caster set in GW1: 20% for 1 to activate, 12% for the other, and 4% for both. —Dr Ishmael
12:59, 3 October 2012 (UTC)
- Numbers are not your strong suit, are they?
- A 20/20 set from GW1 gives an independent 20% chance for each effect. Which means that each effect has a 20% total chance of happening, including the 20% * 20% = 4% chance that they both activate at once, which means each one has a 20% - 4% = 16% chance of activating alone. --192.168.104.79 17:41, 3 October 2012 (UTC)
- In reply to the note from "192.168.104.82 08:26, 3 October 2012 (UTC)", I believe that you are correct regarding that old stacking percentage written being wrong. At the time of posting this, the percentage in the note is not 24% anymore, but 34%, and that is also wrong; it would be wrong whether the stacking is additive or multiplicative, in fact! Because indeed, if it is additive, then it is obviously 40%, and if it is multiplicative then it is = 1 - ( (1 - 0.2) * (1 - 0.2) ) = 0.36, and that means the multiplicative percentage should be 36%.
- The math really isnt that hard. both sigils have a 20% chance to activate. but we are looking at cumulative since they are the same effect. 20% chance 1 activates. in the 80% chance 1 doesnt activate the other one has a 20% chance to activate = 16%. In the 20% chance the first one activated the second one has a 20% chance of that to activate = 4%. thats 20% + 16% + 4% = 40% chance. However, one sigil activating puts the other on CD and since there is a 4% chance of both activating at same time we only need to add chance of 1 activating and the chance of the second one activating when the first has NOT activated. that is 36%. Both have a 20% chance of activating but that 4% of the time they overlap only one counts aka 20% and 16%. yet another way to look at it, to activate independently wihtout the other activating they each have a 16% chance of procing solo. they both have a 4% chance of procing together, 8%. but since only one can give effect it "hides" the others 4%. 16+16+4 = 36%. Justice 06:56, 7 October 2012 (UTC)
- Sorry forgot something. Someone mentioned gw1. Early on in gw1 both the recharge 20/20 and hct sets could stack unlike these sigils. so each one could activate 20% of the time just like the sigils here however there was a 4% chance that they both activated 1/4 casting or recharging. However that does not change one fact, each had a 16% chance of procing alone and 4% chance of over lapping. 32% chance to 1/2 cast or recharge and 4% chance to 1/4 it. Its still 36% chance, not 40%, SOMETHING will happen. Justice 07:10, 7 October 2012 (UTC)
Stacking difference in sPvP
I noticed in structured PvP that charges increment no less than 5 per kill instead of 1. At least stat-stacking sigils, it was Superior Sigil of Perception that I was using (I think in PvP it's called PvP Sigil of Minor Accuracy). I am certain that the first kill always resulted in 5 charges (+50 Precision), but I wasn't quite paying close attention otherwise (on occasion it felt like it was only 3 kills to reach 25 charges, but I don't see why that would be true, steady 5 makes plenty sense). Still a maximum of 25 charges (+250 Precision). I've gone ahead and added that much to the Notes of the article so it is known, but I don't know any wiki standards so you might want to review and change it. --192.168.104.83 13:24, 15 October 2012 (UTC)
Weapon Sets
Are the sigils only active for the current weapon set or are all sigils on both weapon sets considered active? (Ex: Sigil of Accuracy on a Longbow and Sigil of Agony on a 2H Sword.) Will the sigil of Agony still activate when attacking with the Longbow? Garkus 04:00, 20 October 2012 (UTC)
No they only count when you are using them. 114.198.7.200 01:37, 1 November 2012 (UTC)
Do plus duration sigils stack?
Suppose you dual-wield two weapons, each with a Minor Sigil of Agony, each of which is supposed to increase bleeding duration by 5%. Is bleeding duration increased by 5%, 10%, or something else? 114.198.7.200 09:27, 31 October 2012 (UTC)
- My guess is the would stack multiplicatively, so 1.05 x 1.05 = 1.1025, i.e. 10.25% increased bleeding duration --Combatter 10:47, 1 November 2012 (UTC)
Duration sigils are additive to all other increases. Only certain traits seem to be a multiplier. 66.87.0.188
Cooldown Sharing
Re: A single cooldown is shared by all sigils There's not much information on cooldowns as a whole. (In fact, cooldown redirects to recharge, and has nothing on cooldowns from sigils, runes or traits) Do these share cooldowns with runes? Do these share cooldowns with traits? Example: Rune of Water (4): 5% chance to remove a condition when hit. (Cooldown: 30s) (6): When you use a healing skill, you and your allies are healed for a small amount. (Cooldown: 10s) I'd hate for (4) to trigger, and then make it so (6) can't trigger for 30 seconds. Or worse, a Sigil of rage with a 45 second cooldown, preventing the 6th portion of the rune of water from triggering. Or worse still, Earth magic's trait "Earth's Embrace" 90 second cooldown, preventing the 6th portion of the rune of water from triggering.
Different sigil in Main Hand to Offhand
Hi, I just want some clarification - if I have one sigil (corruption) on my Sword, and another on my torch (smoldering) will I get the benefits of both? Thanks in advance. 86.176.218.194 18:06, 4 November 2012 (UTC)
- Corruption is a stacking sigil that increases condition damage, and smoldering increases burn dutation. So yes, you should get the benefits of both those sigils, assuming that you are currently using the sword and torch. The stack of corruption will remain if you swap weapons, but the smoldering sigil wouldn't count if you aren't currently wielding the weapons. 114.198.7.200 06:21, 12 November 2012 (UTC)
Adding a sigil makes the weapon ACCOUNT bound to yourself
This page used to say that adding a sigil makes a weapon soulbound, but testing shows that to be incorrect. It makes the weapon account bound. You can still trade it to other characters of your own if you haven't yet actually equipped the weapon on any one character. It does not become soulbound until you actually equip it. 74.193.70.55 15:30, 28 November 2012 (UTC)
Sigil of Doom and the Elementalist
I did some testing with the sigil of doom and the Elementalist attunements.
Firstly, it's true of all weapon swap sigils that they need to be attached to both the main hand and offhand weapons for the elementalist.
This page says the sigil of doom doesn't work, and that's partly true. I found that you can get the poison effect once each time you enter battle when you switch to Earth attunement only. This was tested with dagger main, focus off-hand.174.6.8.40
