User talk:Yoe Dude/Archive 2

Some Love

arble garble--Relyk ~ talk > 09:06, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Picture of the week

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--Relyk ~ talk > 02:35, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

location

You can test this on {{infobox location}}. List all the locations an NPC or object is in separated by commas and it will generate a pretty list. You can fix current objects and NPCs although it's not implemented yet.--Relyk ~ talk > 08:26, 11 May 2013 (UTC)

Very cool I will add this to any objects/npc I create, once it's live and I can see it work I'll run through the object list and correct all. Is it possible to make this or something similar work on the "| goals =" line of the infobox as well?Yoe Dude (talk) 15:28, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

Hi

You're keeping busy!! --Claret (talk) 22:08, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, I just can't sit here very long as of yet Yoe Dude (talk) 19:25, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

You have been "nominated"

User_talk:Stephane_Lo_Presti#Opportunity_for_the_wiki Say if you are interested. I think you would be a good choice. --Claret (talk) 19:22, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

File:User Yoe Dude Birthday.jpg

Hi, what's the source of that image? I'm guessing it's copyrighted and not usable on the wiki, but I'd like to be sure. pling 15:14, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

(logging in from friends)This photo is a 60's press release/promo shot. I have a copy, framed (signed), given to me at a convention by Mr. Shatner. No copyright info on picture, and it can be found on 100's of sites. If you can give me until I get home I'll try and link one that has copyright info, but I am reasonably sure its right to use for private non commercial use. I'll check more in about 9 hours and if I cant find anything I'll tag it for deletion. (Yoe Dude) 204.14.79.94 20:35, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

The GFDL is a commercial license, and anything licensed under it needs proper attribution and can be used by anyone else. I would think it's copyrighted to whoever owns Star Trek. We can't allow images under fair use, only GFDL (and compatible licenses), ArenaNet copyright and public domain. If it's not one of those three, chances are it's not allowed, I'm afraid. pling 12:42, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

Ok as near as I can tell there is 3 groups that claim to own this image: CBS entertainment, Bantom books (Transworld), and Everett collection. Most news articles credit CBS which has one licence, fansites credit Transworld, (those that give credit that is) and commercial sites use Everett (which sells those types of rights). I read CBS's rights which lead me to believe: If Mr Shatner as Capt. Kirk was coming to a GW2 wiki event we could use this image to advertise his appearance. Everett I would need to pay $5 to use this picture and I can't find Transworlds rights anywhere through my searching, but in any case I would need to "credit" this image, and for a silly picture not that important to the wiki it's not really worth any hassle... Tagging for speedly deletion. Yoe Dude (talk) 19:22, 22 June 2013 (UTC)

Covington Keep POI

Hello! Just checking... are we putting events, npcs and all that jazz on POI pages too now? --Alad (talk) 09:37, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

I certainly hope so or I've been wasting a lot of time these past few months... See Guild Wars 2 Wiki:Location formatting, my foe list can be found on that pages talk page, and I have a copy and paste version on my user links. I've been doing these since maybe January. I list where I working on my "Where am I?" part of my front user page, currently Caledon Forest and Bloodtide Coast which I should finish today, then I'm on to Sparkfly Fen. I list my progress on Guild Wars 2 Wiki:Projects/Cartography and User:Dr ishmael's user page. Yoe Dude (talk) 11:55, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

There was some discussion regarding the level of detail that should go with each level in a zone. Like many discusions, it did not seem to reach a firm conclusion. Yoe Dude has done a meticulous job filling out POIs. What's lacking to an extent, and maybe will need someone else to work on, is the replication of much of that material at area level. If an area contains a POI, it's true to say that a NPC at or in the POI is also in the area. My personal opinion is that sometimes the level of detail is overmuch for POIs but that's not to try to say that I'm right and Yoe's wrong. Probably over information, well laid out, is better than too little. --Claret (talk) 12:40, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

At one point I was trying to fix each thing in an entire zone: POIs, areas, events, hearts, NPCs, objects... see Mount Maelstrom. But honestly it was taking me way too long to do and I really don't like to make dialog or lore info, and there are users that really like making those pages. I also am not that comfortable in making long descriptions, since I'm sure I drift into speculation while lore folks know what to write. Claret as I understand is working on events and hearts, so I have not really making any of those I find except for stubs and I think she is doing the same for POI's since that is where I am now concentrating.

I do fully intend to return to making zones pages next and then at some point the area pages, but I think that the NPC info should not be on area pages, they would be very long articles. At one point there were maybe 50 users doing cartography but now I think there may be only 3-5 folks that aren't just making stubs. My dream is one day in the not to distant future to say "POI's are finished!" but it is still a long way off.

And things change from time to time, I'm sure Maelstrom needs a re-work due to new formatting, see {{area|events}} as just one example. Many area's will need to be revisited but I believe this will be a quick fix. I still see "red links" and lots of stubs in the area pages. I have quite a few charactors that have not completed 100% of the map and I use this to level them up, and to verify objects and things only seen before you complete the renown hearts.

I chose the smallest location page to fill in first, and then plan to work my way to the next level and so on. Yoe Dude (talk) 18:07, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

That's cool, and a lot of work. :) Just out of curiosity, how do you determine the POI's "area" to include the info or not? Perhaps events can include a "nearest POI" parameter? --Alad (talk) 19:45, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

<reset indent>That was somewhat discussed by me, and it's basically my call within reason. But first events, I have found some that were linked to POI's and this is wrong because the event infobox needs to be linked to zone so it can auto-add the area to those pages. (coding thingies, not anything I understand). They need to be added by hand to POI pages and perhaps could be mentioned on the event pages themselves but in the description part. Most of the events are defend/retake the POI that I include, and some kill the guy ones. I don't normally include events that end, pass through, or you can start at the POI but move off elsewhere.

The my call part... Some POI's are no brainers, these are forts and the like, if it's inside the walls it counts. Next would be one's like this discussions example. I this case I felt the "Keep" was the collected buildings that were the POI and I need to include the ground part connecting it all, but not so much the beach or the hills. This is why I only included the two events, while there are five that happen right in this area. Caves and underwater areas I tend to count from the entrance of the place, these are the most likely to need getting there descriptions and maps. And lastly Objects and places that are POI's for no reason I can see, (lore folks help me out here), I use a large aggro circle. Anything you could shoot with a ranged weapon while walking around the object or from an aggro bubble of an open field POI. Yoe Dude (talk) 20:19, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

You mean, I think, the event infobox needs to be linked to area(s), (zone being generated behind the scenes). I thinks it's up for discussion if the NPCs "in" POIs appear on the area page. I have a feeling they should, but I am but a lonely voice. It's an observable phenomenon, IRL as well as on the wiki, that many people can't appreciate the full depth of my brilliance, and, humble person that I am, I have learned to live with this. --Claret (talk) 23:19, 30 June 2013 (UTC)

Why the heck do you have NOEDITSECTION on your talk page? (coming from User:Yoe Dude/TabsTop) Anyway, I agree with Claret - the location hierarchy is regions -> zone -> area, so NPCs need to be listed at least on the area they appear in. Listing them for PoIs is subjective, because a PoI is just a point on a map that is associated with a structure of some sort. PoIs do not have defined boundaries like areas do, so it's difficult to say what is located "within" a PoI. —Dr Ishmael 00:03, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Hi Ishmael. If the area pages get generated automatically in the future, what would be required for the POI pages to be auto-generated too? (I'd say there are more POIs than areas, hence potentially more manual labor on those). --Alad (talk) 00:45, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Yes, Area is what I ment to say... No clue how anything really works on my user page, but I fixed and also the no TOC which I was looking for, thanks. Another zone's pages are done but now the chat codes dont show for me? what did I break now? Yoe Dude (talk) 00:51, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

which zone?/area? --Claret (talk) 00:54, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Ish has fixed it --Claret (talk) 01:01, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Sorry, code error in the infobox. —Dr Ishmael 01:02, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

@Alad - Areas are pretty well defined. POIs are not. Theoretically they are a point with no area but in game they may be a hilltop or a keep. Writing rules to encompass all the possibilities would be quite a task. Also, once they are done, as Yoe seems to be doing, then they are done with only expansions to take care of.

is there talk of automating area pages, if so, please point me at it. {{area hearts}} and {{area events}} go some way and {{area pois}} and {{area skills}} would be, I think, straightforward. But the rest? Really, {{area events}} is the most significant as people are stiff discovering new ones and quite often forget to add them to the area pages. --Claret (talk) 01:07, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Map completion objectives are very static - hearts, skill challenges, and vistas haven't changed since release. Waypoints and PoIs less so, we get maybe 1 or 2 of them with each Living Story arc. Still, none of them really need automation because they're so static. We could subst: the area hearts template into everything and no one would know the difference a month/year from now. There's little need, other than making things easier for editors right now, to extend that paradigm for the other objectives. —Dr Ishmael 01:41, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Claret, ideally any list can and should be auto-generated. Areas, skills, traits, etc... This causes updating just the object to be necessary, without the need to update all the lists manually and forgetting some and adding some entries that don't belong, etc... A never-ending struggle. Areas are made up of lists, mostly. If POI's are to be the same, and given there are more of those than areas, then it would make sense to automate those too, wouldn't it? When even updating the objects (skill/trait changes, icon changes, new foods, etc...) also becomes automated (thanks, for example, to "change flags" which the devs would kindly insert for wiki scans to detect after an update), the wiki editors will be freed of a lot of "database" work, which is the most sensitive in terms of information content and accuracy, but the most tedious and error-prone as well. Then we can write descriptions, walkthroughs, notes clarifying skills and traits, and everything that is not in the database. This is, at least, what I hope our good programmers, on both sides, will be able to achieve. :) --Alad (talk) 04:03, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Alad, certainly agree with you, the data integrity of various locations is very poor in places. Now, {{area hearts}} works fine as does events. Pois and skill could too. But I really can't see how automating lists of NPCs would be easy. And, as Ish says, the data will settle down "soon". But if it could be done - fine. There are several matters that may bear with revisiting before that but if there is a move to that then I guess we could discuss it there, I published elsewhere a suggestion for an {{area stuff}} to put in the zone lists table but as things like waypoints and vistas only exist in text, that might be a problem. Anyway, I think this conversation is probably in the wrong place, maybe retart it elsewhere. --Claret (talk) 04:55, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Your schedule

To avoid cross editing stuff, what's your to-do list? --Claret (talk) 04:58, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

I do post it on my user page User:Yoe Dude/Locations, also on my main page, but it is kinda cryptic. Beth's message means I am running her to Orr to start work there but not too much of a hurry, not likely to start her this week. Harm is who I am trying to level the most, she just entered Sparkfly Fen. I see red links! =) Hermine is adding screens and NPCs to Caledon Forest {Dr Ish did the chat links so these pages are fast}. I jump between those two mostly but will play Tiff or Beth to get dailies done. Steph though not mentioned is rechecking Iron Marches I think. Almost bedtime for me, maybe a page or two more, still kinda in shock my talk page was "hot page of the day". Yoe Dude (talk) 05:14, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

OK, I'll do Brisban next, lotsa red links there - events at least. --Claret (talk) 05:16, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

Done Brisban --Claret (talk) 08:17, 6 July 2013 (UTC)

very cool! I finished Caledon Forest...I started Cursed Shore and perhaps The Grove. Sparkfly is going very slowly, since I'm also doing area pages at the same time by popular request. Did you get screenshots for Brisban? If not I'll move there. (Remember I like taking screens so no worries, really) Yoe Dude (talk) 15:31, 6 July 2013 (UTC)

My screenshots are terrible. You use them is a very atmospheric way. I wouldn't even try to emulate you. But yeah, no more red links in Brisban although there are events there that are not working as optimally as they could, some seem less thean optimal on all severs. I guested and got a few. But the heart npcs and scouts are up to date. Far from saying that the events do not need fleshing out. They do (go-go Musha). But they're there now.

Isn't English interesting, they're there and their, vein, vane and vain, you're and your, etc. The biggest problem was writing the dialogues. When you transcribe, you hold a picture in your mind from the screen and write it. But US English is increasinly different from UK, not just travellers and travelers, not just recognise and recognize but in US you "go eat" and we "go to eat", you often "miss out" bits. It's mind numbing checking for stuff like that, you have to go over every word. I wish there was a screen text capture but that would be too easy. There again, to two and too. Also US writes a list "alpha, beta, and gamma" while UK leaves last comma out. As for "gotten", well we don't use it, apart from the kids who learnt to read in the Internet. Sorry if I bore you (bore boar bored board), it's an interest of mine. Reminds me of when I was living in the US, not long arrived. Went to get the kids' school supplies and asked for some "rubbers" which is Britspeak for erasers. Got a few strange looks. --Claret (talk) 15:54, 6 July 2013 (UTC)

Very cool! I'll pencil in Brisban for some-one to go visit, and flesh out some pages there =) Yoe Dude (talk) 19:02, 7 July 2013 (UTC)

I made a "landmark" entry for Kraitbane Haven as it seemed to be a natural structure and deserving of some attention. Letting you know in case you want to give it the Yoe Dude treatment. --Claret (talk) 12:21, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

also for Charrgate Haven - sorry - thanks for Kraitbane --Claret (talk) 22:29, 9 July 2013 (UTC)

<reset indent> I'm thinking of ending this disscusion, but you can still comment here. I never really answered you last part... the scariest thing that happened to me while I was touring Europe, well London anyways, was I got on this double-decker bus and the large hairy bus driver greets me with "Hey sweets, can you spare a fag?" (I was cuter back then). So I do know there are different uses of words on your side of the pond. My band mate Steve is from Manchester and his wife is from South Africa so I tell them that this "page 4" girl sounds just like Carol, only to be informed she's South London, And they say I use "colorful four letter" words to much while Steve is always "bloody this and that". So what do I know? Just this, we play the Beatles, Stones, Bowie, and silly Andy here gets to sing those songs because "I have the better English Accent" than the guy that came from there. Mine's Liverpool and you can guess which four blokes taught me, but I mispronounce place names since I learn them phonetically... 4,000 holes in Blackford Lanconshire... That said, here any person that talks in a British accent gets 1 extra point {on the 1-10 scale} so if you have any single co-workers who like to talk to crazy Americans... I'm sure I will fall madly in love just with the voice. (no hairy bus drivers please) =) Yoe Dude (talk) 22:39, 9 July 2013 (UTC)