User talk:1Maven/Artisan template
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Usefulness[edit]
this isn't a useful template. Just create the actual NPC pages.--Relyk ~ talk < 10:51, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
- Can you please be more specific. What makes this template less useful then say {{Template:Dialogue/Master chef}}? I find it quite useful, allowing changes to essentially identical articles to be made simultaneously by editing one place. Is that not the purpose of a template? ~ 1Maven (talk) 11:35, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
- What changes will ever be made to these articles? None. These NPCs have existed in the same location, doing the same thing, since the game was launched. The only thing that might change is the dialogue, and as you pointed out, that's already in a separate template. Just subst: this template onto those 8 pages and we can delete it. —Dr Ishmael
13:14, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
- What changes will ever be made to these articles? None. These NPCs have existed in the same location, doing the same thing, since the game was launched. The only thing that might change is the dialogue, and as you pointed out, that's already in a separate template. Just subst: this template onto those 8 pages and we can delete it. —Dr Ishmael
- So? It's only 8 pages. Making a change across 8 pages is nothing. I've made changes to over a hundred pages at once before. Templates are not necessary to enforce uniform structure of an entire page. —Dr Ishmael 14:10, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
- So? It's only 8 pages. Making a change across 8 pages is nothing. I've made changes to over a hundred pages at once before. Templates are not necessary to enforce uniform structure of an entire page. —Dr Ishmael
- You don't understand - it's not just a matter of page numbers. The dialogue templates are useful because Anet does occasionally add new master craftsmen to the game, and they have also changed the dialogue a few times in the past. Thus, we can be fairly certain that the template will remain useful in the future, whether to make a change to the dialogue or to add it to a new page. On the other hand, this template is not useful because the NPCs are static, there's zero chance that new instances of them will be added to WvW, and the only information about them that might change is already contained in other templates (subpages of Template:Inventory and Template:Dialogue). Thus, after the content is solidified (which I think it pretty much is by now), this template will remain completely static, which means it's no better than putting the content directly on the pages. —Dr Ishmael 16:48, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
- You don't understand - it's not just a matter of page numbers. The dialogue templates are useful because Anet does occasionally add new master craftsmen to the game, and they have also changed the dialogue a few times in the past. Thus, we can be fairly certain that the template will remain useful in the future, whether to make a change to the dialogue or to add it to a new page. On the other hand, this template is not useful because the NPCs are static, there's zero chance that new instances of them will be added to WvW, and the only information about them that might change is already contained in other templates (subpages of Template:Inventory and Template:Dialogue). Thus, after the content is solidified (which I think it pretty much is by now), this template will remain completely static, which means it's no better than putting the content directly on the pages. —Dr Ishmael
- Are you saying that everything related to Artisan NPCs will remain static with the introduction of Desert Borderlands or is there a reasonable chance of change with the introduction of the upcoming Heart of Thorns release? Is there a possibility that Artisan NPCs will also be present in Desert Borderlands? ~ 1Maven (talk) 19:04, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
- We can deal with "what-if" statements all day, like "what if the artisan in Desert Borderlands is completely different". We can't answer those questions because we aren't ArenaNet and isn't helpful for discussion.
- This discussion has come up before on the referenced templates. A wrapper template like this makes it impossible for normal users to edit pages and sections. A template makes it harder to syntax-specific information to the page like tables. You also can't add information specific the NPC, like the locations and any bugs. The use of a template isn't consistent with other NPC pages.
- The Template:Inventory and Template:Dialogue suffer from similar issues, such as editors sticking text in an inventory template about a bug. Users have also been confused on how to make changes to an inventory. The dialogue template for master chef has only been changed once since last year because of the crafting license.--Relyk ~ talk < 01:05, 31 May 2015 (UTC)
- Are you saying that everything related to Artisan NPCs will remain static with the introduction of Desert Borderlands or is there a reasonable chance of change with the introduction of the upcoming Heart of Thorns release? Is there a possibility that Artisan NPCs will also be present in Desert Borderlands? ~ 1Maven (talk) 19:04, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
- "A wrapper template like this makes it impossible for normal users to edit pages and sections." I think that's the best argument against this. The dialogue and inventory templates are acceptable exceptions because they contain a lot of special formatting. This template, in comparison, is extremely simple, and thus doesn't qualify for the same exception. —Dr Ishmael 01:22, 31 May 2015 (UTC)
- "A wrapper template like this makes it impossible for normal users to edit pages and sections." I think that's the best argument against this. The dialogue and inventory templates are acceptable exceptions because they contain a lot of special formatting. This template, in comparison, is extremely simple, and thus doesn't qualify for the same exception. —Dr Ishmael
